Curious

[lady_karelia]

So, there seems to be a new trend in the newbies' writing styles... Don't ask!

I figured I'd ask here what gets you or puts you off a fic...

[Poll #1307086]

Comments

[elise-wanderer.livejournal.com]

One or two bits of bad punctuation, grammar, and/or spelling sometimes get through, but the mods on the sites I visit most often seem to catch most of the mistakes. Too much of it elsewhere will stop me.

More often, I'm stopped by writing that just sounds wrong to my "ear." A character who goes by the name of Severus Snape, for example, but bears little relationship to any incarnation I've ever met.

I know you said don't ask, but I'm curious about the trend you're discovering.

Kisses to the Ticky Box.

[lady-karelia.livejournal.com]

What I've been noticing is a distinct lack of quality in the majority of fanfic writing lately. I will elaborate on a separate post, as a few have asked about it.

I agree with the odd errors getting through; it's normal, and it even appears in printed material. :)

[melusin-79.livejournal.com]

Also curious about what trends you're using.
'Gotten' is a back button issue for me if used in dialogue.

[lady-karelia.livejournal.com]

I'll make a separate post on the trends I've noticed lately, as several have asked.

I hear ya on 'gotten,' although that is one I actually can understand if the author is American. As a beta reader, I will always tag it, but as an admin I can't. LOL

[natasnape.livejournal.com]

It all comes down to plot and characterisation for me. Without exciting plot and with flat characters no author can quip my interest. The saddest cases happen in stories from authors I love that succumb to poor characterisation. Technical aspects of writing do not put me off as I only read at moderated archives where stories are more or less void of grammar and punctuation mistakes.

Moreover, over the last year or so, extensive sex scenes tend to put me off if they hinder plot too much. A nice ~1000 words hot piece is suitable, but whole steamy chapters where nothing happens are just nuisance. I would search out a PWP for those, thank you. But in plot-driven stories, this is just annoying.

[lady-karelia.livejournal.com]

Yup, that is part of what I've been noticing, the needless sex scenes *sighs*

[alienor77310.livejournal.com]

If the newbie is really a newbie, I might be gentle and send her to PI to get herself a beta. After that, perseverare diabolicum.

In fanfic, my own backbutton issues have mostly to do with characterization. Infantile writing, too, more than purple prose.

[juniperus.livejournal.com]

Seconded - OOC (well, and writing in some sort of combination of l33tsp34k and valley-girl throwback) is the quickest way to back-button for me - three chapters, nothing - I rarely make it to the end of the first.

Sometimes it's the end of the first 'graph.

I am impatient. And cranky. :P

[lady-rhian.livejournal.com]

The key word for me is depth. Is the story original? Is the writing engaging? Is the plot beyond a basic scenario? If the writing is simple and the plot is overused, I'm hitting the back button. That said, given that I don't read nearly as much as I used to, I rely on recs often from the f-list, so it's not often that I hit the back button.

[ariadne1.livejournal.com]

Hm... I hit "ticky box" because for #1 it's a combination of technically good writing and something else. Mistakes, OOC: bad. Plot, entertaining: good.

Regarding which will make me hit the back button: any of the ones you listed, although the medical terminology doesn't really bother me one way or the other - not my thing, but... *shrugs*

*waves*

[bloodcult.livejournal.com]

When a story has no new plot points, ideas, presentation, or themes set forth in the first two chapters I won't waste my time on the rest of it.
Similarly, if Hermione sounds not only like an American teenager but particularly slow-witted American teenager then the back button is my friend.

[lady-karelia.livejournal.com]

Oh, the slow-witted American teen Hermione is a brilliant example that features far too often in fic these days!

[silverdoe7127.livejournal.com]

If a story has a well developed plot, I can ignore most grammar mistakes as long as the story can gain my attention before the mistakes piss me off. If it doesn't it's the back button. I can't complain about punctuation as I am still learning to use it properly. I will almost always avoid something with numerous spelling errors. If the writer can't take the time to run spell check, I can't take the time to read it. One or two is no big deal. I can be a little OCD about misspelled words and even I make mistakes and miss something occasionally.
OOC will not necessarily kill a story unless it is so very far from the original character, that it totally kills the image I have of that person.

[lady-karelia.livejournal.com]

I find spelling mistakes simply unacceptable in the age of spellchecks. Punctuation, yes, it takes time to learn the rules, and that doesn't necessarily put me off someone's writing. :)

[mazzy2121.livejournal.com]

Since I've only written two stories (and only finished one) aside from a few drabbles, I'd be interested to hear the trends you are seeing. I'd rather know aobut them and try to avoid them if they cause a readers eyes to roll, then to just be made fun of after the fact.

Also, agian with the still slightly 'newbie-ness', what the hell is "ticky box"? LOL

[mazzy2121.livejournal.com]

One more quesiton lol - Is there really a difference between 'Purple Prose' and 'not my type of writing'? I admit I'm not very literature savy, but it kind of seems like the same thing to me.

For Purple Prose, I'm thinking of when I start reading a good fic and the author feels the need to interrupt me every five minutes to spend twelve sentences (complete with parentheses, en dashes, em dashes and every obscure descriptive word imaginable) describing something as simple as "Hermione sat on an ornate rug."

I won't hit the back button for it, but I'll definitely start just skimming and that's what I consider 'not my type of writing' or 'too wordy' with a side of 'wrap it up please'. :)

So, is there a difference that I'm just not understanding in my literacy-illiterate mind?

[ltgarrix.livejournal.com]

Well, I only read at moderated archives (when I find time to read) because I don't want to slog through stories full of grammar and spelling errors. A few here and there I can live with because you see those even in published works. No one is perfect despite their best efforts. I do want my story have a well developed plot and generally I expect the major plot point to be set up in the first chapter. That's what will draw me in.

Obviously characterization is important as well. I need to recognize the characters from the story. Now if the fic is set in the future, I know that the characters will have changed, but I need enough information to understand how those changes came to be. I mean don't have Hermione as a rabid Quidditch fan unless you can really sell me on that. Also, don't have Snape suddenly metrosexual without a darned good explanation.

Now that's not to say the other choices wouldn't be a turn off for me, this is just the biggest turnoff. Not to say I don't like an occasional PWP, but not chapter after chapter of it.

Like one of the others, if characterization and/or plot is off, I generally won't make it past the first chapter. Rarely have I made it past the first chapter only to quit later, though there have been some stories that started out very good, but were drug on past their shelf life, probably because the author was getting a lot of reviews and decided to keep going.

[lady-karelia.livejournal.com]

but were drug on past their shelf life, probably because the author was getting a lot of reviews and decided to keep going.

Oh, that is so very, very true!

[(Anonymous)]

Generally, it takes a combination of grievances to make me quit a story.

I cannot stand illogical leaps in the plot or characterization without adequate explanation (perhaps this falls under 'lack of plot/character development'). I've seen Hermione vehemently disagree with something fundamentally against her character but have her 'convinced' within two short dialogue exchanges that all will be well if she completely changes her mind. It's even worse when an author introduces a radical plot device without adequate (and interesting) explanation. If you're going to force two characters to marry, then you'd better have a damned solid explanation.

Drama and angst can be done well, but I won't read angsty stories that don't offer something redeeming in the way of character interpretation or mystery or at the bare minimum hope that the drama will resolve (rather than new drama every chapter).

[pyjamapants.livejournal.com]

That was me.... silly login cookies are misbehaving.

[teshara.livejournal.com]

In fiction you have to make me curious. If I am not curious about something it's over within the first chapter. Make me want to read more.

In fanfic I can't stand stuff that's not canon compliant no matter what fandom. AU's only accepted if they have a cut off point. (Canon up to book 3 or whatever.)

[lady-karelia.livejournal.com]

I absolutely agree on the curiosity factor. I love those fics that leave me thinking, 'oh, wow, I cannot wait for the next chapter.'

Canon compliance, yes, that too. I can't stand it when George is killed instead of Fred, that sort of thing.

[kittylefish.livejournal.com]

usually if i use the back button it's because the writing doesn't appeal to me on some level, i.e., i'm BORED. if there are so many errors i can't find the plot or characters, i will hit back, but that doesn't happen as much these days because i mostly read at tpp and the admins there rock! i admit, my respect for authors rises as i notice that they clearly care enough to try to ensure that their stories are posted free of errors.

that said - if i get totally hooked on the characters/plot, i've been known to slog through quite a mess to find out what happens. but not very often.

i was reading the comments and the one i'm nervous about in my own writing is "unnecessary sex scenes." i swear, even when i try to keep it clean sometimes it just happens. but believe it or not, i have on occasion edited them out. (i keep those in my own "unexpurgated" versions.)

[lady-karelia.livejournal.com]

Yeah, and there lies the crux: you CARE about your writing. You think about it, you even get nervous about some things and wonder whether to change it... Honestly, your writing never entered my mind when I was putting this together. Your writing is sound, and even though you have room for improvement, you're constantly working on that. That is the difference between the likes of us and the writers I gripe about. But I'll explain it in more detail in a separate entry. This has been a great discussion so far!

[astarrymist.livejournal.com]

Okay, what is "purple prose?"

[dreamy-dragon73.livejournal.com]

I took the ticky box option on both because I can't resist ticky boxes. Usually I'd go with the first option in the first question, but I find it depends a lot on the pairing I'm reading. I'm a lot more willing to forgive a few things in a Lucius/Hermione fic because there are so few good stories with that pairing anyway whereas I get impatient with Severus/Hermione stories rather quickly because I'm used to the better quality of writing in that pairing.

I don't mind the occasional typo or misplaced comma, but generally sloppy writing, not only in terms of SpaG, puts me off reading.
Other things that have me hit the back button fairly quickly (and it usually doesn't take three chapters) are unlikely characterisation, lazy or sloppy handling of plot, and lack of basic research, or simply a style I don't find appealing.

I think there are different ways to see the characters especially if a fic is set long after the end of canon because obviously they could develop in different ways, but some things feel just wrong to me. The example of Hermione turning into a slow-witted American teenager someone mentioned above is a good example of what I'd consider unlikely.

I don't necessarily need a completely new or original plot idea, but I'd like to see the plot handled in a thoughtful or even unique way not just a repetition of tired old clichés or a lazy device to bring the couple together. Badly written sex scenes is another thing that puts me off.

Finally lack of basic research, not only in terms of canon, but also in terms of character speech and setting is another thing that will make me stop reading.

*pets ticky box*

[veradee.livejournal.com]

I'm sure I overlook some typos and punctuation errors, but if it gets so bad that I start thinking that even I could do a better job, I hit the back button.

All in all, I'm most interested in "good" characterisation, though. I like to see how a character behaves and why he does so. I want to understand him and see him develop. For me that goes hand in hand with the characters not being OOC, but I realised a long time ago that what I regard as OOC other readers / writers don't regard in the same way and vice versa.

[lady-karelia.livejournal.com]

While in a so-so fic punctuation bothers me no end, if the characterisation and/or plot is good, I will ignore the punctuation, yes.

As with ooc, I totally understand this. And it goes hand in hand with personal preference, yes? I hear you on that one. But if a fic is full of very obvious errors, such as using a comma before each adverb, continuously misspelling canon words in obvious ways, and the narrative is full of personal comments (as in "like I pointed out in chapter 3 in this fic"), it kind of loses its appeal. *snrk*

[blue-paris.livejournal.com]

Yay ticky boxes!!

I wonder how many people are going to think I'm a total retard, not realizing that I do, in fact, live with you, and can just *tell* you my thoughts.

[lady-karelia.livejournal.com]

The ticky boxes were, of course, entirely for your entertainment. ;)

I have no idea to that thought... I guess not many connect the dots, eh?

[sunnythirty3.livejournal.com]

always wondered what ticky boxes meant!
SPaG isnt a problem on moderated archives usually.
Purple prose, unnecessarily frequent or drawn out sex scenes, I mean how many times can one couple have sex in a night, and do we need the complete description of every act?

Gotten... YUK!

Bald dialogue with no description of the character's feelings, or the other extreme; every little nuance described in endless detail. Overdescription of the room, the clothes, the food...

[lady-karelia.livejournal.com]

Hee, thanks. I hear ya on the unnecessarily drawn-out sex scenes. And on gotten. Although, as I said in some other comment, I can see where they're coming from. Also, did you not love Denial? Did you not either entirely ignore 'gotten' or at least filed it away to gripe over on a rainy day? I certainly did! LOL

[stefdarlin.livejournal.com]

I admit, I had to look up purple prose.(Hmmm... looks around guiltily, heh.) But then, I am still learning a lot, too. Occasionally, I overlook spelling errors, especially if English isn't the first language of the author. But plot is usually what lures me into a story.

I also chose the ticky box for the first question because it is a combination of things which causes me to quit reading a story. I suppose unrealistic happenings (such as those that might be gained from experience, and it is plain that no research was done or the experience had by the author) drive me away.

I am glad you are going to list things in a separate post as I am very interested in knowing them. Thanks!

[lady-karelia.livejournal.com]

Nothing wrong with having to look up terms! I do it all the time because I'd be utterly lost otherwise! LOL

I did list things, and please be assured that none of them apply to you or anyone else who replied here. It's mainly about fairly new authors or those who have been hanging about and not learnt anything in writing, those who gripe if they don't win an award or don't get nominated for one.

[sc010f.livejournal.com]

*throws chicken of discussion into the ring*

Lurid prose always turns me off, but more frequently, the yards and yards of exposition at the beginning.

As a SSHG shipper, and one who doesn't like teenage!Hermione, most of the ficcage I'm going to read or write is going to be AU (but of course Snape's not dead, lalalala). I can accept that. It's call suspension of disbelief for criminy sake, so don't spend paragraphs telling me that Snapemiraculouslysurvivedthesnakebiteandisnowlivingahappyandfulfillinglife. Or not. But I think I'm kind of on my own on this, because the one time I did something where Snape recovers, and showed the scene, it wasn't an important part of the story, but I got slammed because everyone was like "hey! that went by too fast!" oops! :)

Just get on with the story. Or in my case the post...

Oh, and yeah - sudden shifts in characters over the space of a paragraph. I read a story once where Hermione hated (hated!) Snape and in the next chapter was swooning over him. I actually went back and read the two chapters twice over in succession to see if I'd missed anything!

This (and your thread this morning/last night?) has been really interesting. Thanks for posting.

Now, 'scuse me while I find some coffee...

*trundles off blearily to office coffee-pot*

[melenka.livejournal.com]

I will forgive some punctuation or spelling errors. One author I like actually makes up words. It amuses me, as I always know exactly what she means by them. I will tolerate purple prose, especially if there is a self-awareness behind it. Call body parts what you will, though I reserve the right to find it boring or extremely funny. Just make sure there is a reason your characters are having sex, or admit that it's PWP (although, personally, I still would like to see some sort of reason they're getting naked together) and state it in the summary.

What I absolutely must have in order to follow any writing, on line or in print, is a strong voice. All the plot in the world won't matter if I am not drawn in by the voice.

[robisonrocket.livejournal.com]

Another thing that will make me not read is if the author is one who writes a shitload of stories (literally one after the other) but doesn't have a lot of variety amongst those stories. I have one specific author in mind, and I really don't bother reading those stories any more because I just don't see how quality can improve much when the focus is on quantity. Or am I just being insensitive?

[lady-karelia.livejournal.com]

Muah, only one? I can think of a few that applies to. And yes, I absolutely agree. If I don't see at least improvement of writing over the months, then I lose interest rapidly because quantity just ain't mah thang. *snrk*

[kribu.livejournal.com]

Woo, another utterly fascinating post. :-D

For me, it largely depends on my mood. Sometimes I want a story with new ideas and depth, other times I'm tired and my brain isn't working and I'd love to read something entirely clichéd, with a plot that has been done a few dozen times before, as long as it flows reasonably well and isn't littered with spelling mistakes.

But in general... hm. I read most anything that was at least somewhat readable when I first got into fic, but have become a lot more picky in the last year. So it's the usual - too many spelling and grammar mistakes (there are some I mind more than others; if the author uses "would of" and such, I'm going to stop reading). A plot that bores me. Randomly thrown in sex scenes, or a story that is otherwise well written but seems to consist of nothing but sex scenes and hasn't been labelled PWP. Characterisation issues: I can give quite a bit of leeway to the writer there, but if they're either quite unrecognisable or just not appealing to me (doormat!Hermione, nasty!Snape who keeps humiliating and hurting her on purpose chapter after chapter), then I stop reading.

Then there are a lot of small things, such as misspelling canon character names (happens even outside ff.net - I've seen far too many Pavartis on Ashwinder for example). Snape wearing knickers or Hermione washing her hair in the loo. Or anything to do with my very personal preferences, such as smoking Snape, a Snape who is a heavy drinker, a Snape who uses prostitutes, a Hermione who happily sleeps around during Hogwarts years... these are things that a good writer can probably make believable, but they just don't appeal to me.

[lady-karelia.livejournal.com]

Glad you like the post! For me it was simple curiosity.

For me personally, it comes down to one thing: if the writing is good, I'll read it. And while my OTP is SSHG, I'll gladly read any pairing or gen fic that is well written. I totally hear you on misspelling canon character names.

On other 'personal preferences' that you mention as off, I recently started writing a fic that just about defies every belief I have. I have no idea where it'll take me. Usually I write an outline before I start writing the fic. This time around, I started writing before I even thought of the outline... It might never see the light of day. LOL